well i'll tell marvin to washington d.c. and here's what's coming up tonight on the big picture romney was declared the unofficial winner of last night's debate but he kept telling one lie after another does misleading america online for ninety minutes really make you a winner and where was the moderate mitt just a few weeks ago last tonight's politics panel and tonight we debut our new your take my take a live segment where you can call in live to ask a question or make a comment on the air stay tuned to find out how you can be on the big picture.

you need to know this what's the point of presidential debates of one candidate can live for a half hour and then be declared the winner that's a question we should all ask ourselves one day after the first presidential debate in denver colorado consensus among pundits is that mitt romney won the debate and strictly in terms of style he did when pressed in the fight all night against a lethargic project president obama is the center for american progress pointed out this morning romney told twenty seven lies or half truths in a matter of just the thirty eight minutes he spoke on stage last night on the lied about his own tax plan saying that it's not a five trillion dollars tax cut despite independent analysts of his plan saying it is a lot about obamacare repeating the same debunked myth that the president cut over seven hundred billion from medicare lied about the president's wall street reform law saying it doesn't need five banks is being too big to fail and deserving

a blank check bailouts there is no such provision in the law and even flirted with the idea of death panels in obamacare president obama's campaign released this ad today highlighting many of these laws. i'm barack obama of i approve this message i'm not in favor of a five trillion dollar tax cut that's not my plan the nonpartisan tax policy center concluded that mitt romney's tax plan would cost four point eight trillion dollars over ten years why won't romney level with this about his tax plan which gives the wealthy huge new tax breaks because according to experts he have to raise taxes on the middle class who are increased the deficit to pay for if we can't trust him here how could we ever trust him here. rather than acting like sportscasters this morning declaring mitt romney the winner in my opinion the media needs to be doing its job in fact checking but ultimately president obama did fail last night he failed at calling out mitt romney as an agent of the. president didn't mention

romney's forty seven percent comments he didn't mention romney's tax dodging offshore tax havens he didn't mention romney's career harvesting businesses of bain and of the president can't make the argument that romney is only looking out for the one percent and in my opinion he's going to lose more on that prospect later and tonight is a daily take for now i want to turn things over to our politics panel our panel tonight andrew langer president is to for liberty richard follow the progressive strategist and brian darlene senior fellow at the heritage foundation thanks for all your years of joining me everyone is saying the mitt romney won fine so my question is how do you lie all night and still get declared a winner twenty seven lies and half truths in thirty eight minutes for example on the tax plan. i'm not in favor of a five trillion dollars tax cut that's not my plan my plan is not to put in place any tax cut that will add to the deficit that's point one so you may keep referring to it as five trillion dollar tax cut but that's not my plan no fact from the tax policy center romney's proposal for

a twenty percent across the board cut in all federal income taxes eliminating the alternative minimum tax eliminating the estate tax and other tax reductions would reduce federal revenue four hundred eighty billion dollars in two thousand and fifteen and romney up until last night had never disputed that that that that that number has been around forever tax policy center study is flawed it is going to sell for has been running a twenty percent cut in taxes is a five trillion dollars in taxes over ten you know first of all that's not a tax increase in the middle class if you're cutting taxes i want to understand and i'm asserting it is well the president did what i wondering is why is romney disavowing it richard why as well i mean disavowing his own or the magistrate. i don't understand why he's disavowing his tax plan with this chills who mitt romney is going to do anything to win and this is that the what that shows he's going to depart from all of his conservative policies now he's the moderate mitt romney and the next debate i guess is going to be conservative again with the flip the coin i mean you know be the liberal never around when you're going to end well i my point

in all of this is mitt romney wasn't disavowing his tax plan last night mitt romney was explaining us tax when explaining the realities of it the fact is we've got a and internal revenue code that is massive massively confusing it cost the american economy huge numbers of dollars every year with folks with anger out of this now suggesting changing what he's saying only twenty one percent across the board he's talking about a limited being deductions and changing things around what making it making that the tax code simpler which i think is something we've all talked about we've all agreed about there are savings that come about from that to the american economy as well so you know it's one of these things where i love it when we focused on the fact that romney is apparently the big fat liar in this when you know you've got the huffington post surprisingly enough which is pointing out a whole host of obama's lies last night about his record about what he wants to do but the real question though andrew is so you're right he might some by the tax code but he says that he wants to grow the middle class and romney care the middle class with simplifying the tax code means you have middle class families and get rid of the child tax credit you hurt middle class families or middle class parents

or get rid of the mortgage the mortgage deduction getting rid of those he well if you don't give any specifics that i will do the same thing oh you know if you say i said he was going to say here's the road here's the problem brian he's never advocating getting rid of it we're getting rid of any deductions so it's laced inductions but it's what he's saying i'm going to i'm going to close loopholes what loopholes trust me just make me president i'll take care of in all fairness in theory here if he eliminates if he if he changes the way the way that you can do deduct taxes and deduct your charitable contributions the bottom line is that hurts the wealthiest americans more than anybody else because they're the ones who give the most to chill that may well be the last twenty does everyone that doesn't do it all because we have no idea what he's going to do is you want to tell us you know the to sit here and sort of. speculate is just pure academics is how many angels can dance to the head of the manager when the president asked yesterday what are you going to cut one thing this is tom i have to one which is where my struggle with the problem i think the president should have more stronger and think i will give you all the time in the world that you need to tell us what the doctrines are

going to get rid of because the american people want to know i want to know and i'm pretty sure the people watching at home one and any should have asked over and over and over again but i'm bored. we can monday morning quarterback that anyhow here's the the medicare the lie on medicare. what i support is no change for current retirees and near retirees to medicare and the president supports taking seven hundred sixteen billion dollars out of that program. it's unfortunate that the president smiles and looks away at who's got to work on that it's true it's the seven hundred sixteen billion dollars was raided it pay for all my care hall ryan identified as waste and fraud and abuse make sure their image is not waste there and to be all it's absolutely is medicare advantage is the privatized part of medicare that the republicans put into medicare and shouldn't be there it's that is why the c.e.o. of united health care has made over a billion dollars well first of all one guy why there's one hundred people who make over a million dollars

a year united health care because of medicare advantage you know what i do not agree but obama said he wants to with less than bush mitt romney has not adopted that portion of the paul ryan plan and said very clearly he wants to pour the money back into medicare and medicare would be converted into a program where you have a choice it's not you're not taking away anybody's benefits you have a choice brian this goes back to the real mitt romney a flip flopper first he says the paul ryan budget the marvelous idea what a marvelous thing he was past that immediately and he says well i want the paul ryan budget but not this part not that far you heard on one simpson bowie's these are within the same but in a we've seen this also from romney on obamacare first look we need to repeal obamacare but not the popular parts we want to keep kids on their parents' health care insurance we want to make sure people with preexisting conditions can get health care but we don't want the other parts of the bill understand that you can't get one part without the other he didn't say that he said he didn't like the state exactly what you know that yesterday he said it was a date should be a model in massachusetts keeps kids on till they're twenty six it mandates

preexisting conditions i don't know nobody's donated money in the development plan to save us and rule in the past he has said that romney care should be and i'm all i know is that the law the more we as americans focus on medical care and health care access as an insurance issue the further away we get from dealing with this problem because whether no matter how you slice it if you look at it as an h.m.o. problem or government one problem the american people in the end lose i mean that's the thing last night that i would have pointed out frank. if i were mitt romney that i would have pointed out to the president that his individual mandate proposal was a massive bailout for big insurance forcing everybody to buy a product does nothing but transfer wealth from one group of people to the h.m.o. system which is part and parcel of what's destroying health care is there is one little piece in there that i think was the big pieces got everybody freaked out and this is what the repeal is all about and that says that after twenty fourteen states can decide to do their own single payer systems that's what happened in canada started says catch want to spread across the country the vermont state legislature has already passed and the governor has signed into law

a bill that in twenty fourteen will start twenty sixteen and will start a single payer health care in vermont and now they're doing this in montana no matter how we slice it if we do not address the underlying problems as to why health care health care costs not health insurance costs health care costs are going up if we increase demand without increasing the supply of doctors nurses and physicians assistants and really destroy homes here in america those are all nice words but twenty percent of the costs right off the top are going to these big corporations and businesses are going to be so so so wedded so we're going to mandate that everybody buy a product for those insurance co your study i suggested that we do what every other developed country in the civilized world has done richard i completely agree with you tom i think but i think obamacare was one step in the right direction i think what the president really wanted was a thing bill payer system that would have all of all the barber who would it would well you know what it would i want to solve our problems with all it would do you might want to give you credit because i think you're right we do need to put more teachers the more nurses in the hospitals and that we should pass before that we should pass the american jobs act unfortunately paul ryan is under forty thousand on fortunate we are not fixing the underlying problems as to why doctors and nurses

and physicians assistants are getting out of this business why they're not going to be was paid enough you're not getting paid enough so that i'm going to there are no no no they're not getting out of this business i have two kids who fall into those categories how do we how do we control how do we control costs of government run health care if you know there's no way to drive those costs down here are those the price is not the sort of i'm not filibuster here how do we how are we going to draw those prices down if we're not going to cut medicaid we're going to cut medicaid. but again all of this limbo my mother is a registered nurse in florida and she'll tell you the story like every other registered nurse that will tell you she will tell you that they're making the nurses take pay cuts while the big people who run in the bank running the running the hospital are getting big corporate bonuses and that's what has to stop and i agree is that we have and my wife has a family physician who will tell you that when you increase patient panels by twenty percent and you drop reimbursement cost of doctors doctors get out if you don't understand the doctors have malpractise insurance called payments that they have to make we haven't fixed them up practice insurance problem they have medical school loan repayments you can't refinance or so all of those things are what you

know it was a lot of games are willing to negotiate with the president obama care we don't probably got that done but you guys that was that was your idea is that obamacare is just one of the break brian has not said we are joining this debate but i would say that tom you pointed out to states and you agree with the single payer systems being set up in those states massachusetts has its own version right why aren't these decisions best made on the state level not done one size fits all the other and obamacare is that starting in two thousand and sixteen states can just do whatever they want well mitt romney agrees with the idea that states should be allowed to have flexibility to do what they are until that part of obamacare he wants to repeal obamacare but conservatives do believe that states should be allowed to take care of these issues go at comprehensive health care reform and i say that sounds nice but they have let's keep in place those laws that prevent the states of doing that will be the laws of these overburdened federal laws that medicare and medicaid that don't give enough flexibility to the states to do what

they want to do with their own money medicare and well ok we will leave you with the last word because it won last last night's debate politics. here is mitt romney. they trying to figure out the name of that thing that we americans call a dollar. i'm sorry i'm just a guy who cares an awful lot about you sir are a fool you know what kind of my terrorist cell is but i want to give us a good feature is on the on the ball and the chris. confusedly stuff out of the. you know the corporate media distract us from what you and i should care about because they're a profit driven industry that sells

a sensationalistic garbage he calls it breaking news i'm not me martin and we're going to break this that. you know sometimes you see a story and it seems so you think you understand it and then you glimpse something else and you hear or see some other part of it and realize that everything is ok. i'm tom harvey welcome to the big picture.

welcome back to that i'd supply a politics panel on our panel tonight ender langar president of the institute for liberty richard follower host of the richard followed radio show and. brian darling senior fellow at the heritage foundation and let's get back to a dodge frank this we were talking about mitt romney's lies here is his lie on dodd frank. i wouldn't disagree eight five banks is too big to fail and give them a blank check that's one of the unintended consequences the dot frank it wasn't thought through properly we need to get rid of that provision. the fact the matter is that provision doesn't exist banks are designated as systemically significant which is not a good thing as it means that they have to abide by more stringent regulations plus

the banks all have basically living wills to be wound down not bailed out dodd frank price of all imitates bailouts no it doesn't at all if you look at the language of dodd frank it gave the fed more power to give loans to these institutions on wall street they're too big to fail institutions are all bigger now ever since the meltdown on wall street that that in receded sadly frank no they're bigger now than they were when the economy melted down two thousand is in style bring all businesses are bigger now but the economy has grown judge frank didn't solve any of the problems a systemic problems we had wall street it didn't do do anything to go it that so so would you suggest that we break up the big banks but no way i think we should repeal dodd frank. you don't like god frank is it doesn't brag of the big banks that they wouldn't want is that got me an annoyed me about this debate last night is that jim lehrer's question was about the regulatory state and all of us on the president turns it to to an issue of dodd frank and the fact is that we cannot as a society ignore the fact that we have

a regulatory state that cost the american economy two trillion dollars annually that edges over that creates the american economy known as a mitt romney correctly pointed out last night without regulations you don't have it on hand and i don't want to rule over a soccer game and no one is talking about eliminating the regulatory state but we have to look at the fact that you were on a second ago you ride them not only to get entirely but we can if we cut the regulatory state by twenty percent we can create twelve million jobs into low gear i'll give you our. completely rather than of what we've seen president obama in these past four years he's limited more regulation of small business is than george bush did in eight years what the right that is a job is don't know but it was a lot through regulatory guidelines for these unlimited regulation when i go to a tournament i just said limited regulations but regulatory cost regulatory costs under obama have gone up forty five percent the idea of the regulator who according to the small business administration and they they do what they do with a five year snapshot of the regulatory state and under obama ok go look it up but some examples cafe standards that's an obama regulation dodd frank is

a law that said i want to start let's start with cafe stand yes do you do you think that we should continue to be subsidizing the oil industry by saying we're going to have our navy protect their shipping lanes they're not going to pay for any of that we're going to we're going to subsidize their drilling there you know. or your and your wife's is going to treat their ok and the cancer is going to governor romney pointed out last night green energy is getting far more in subsidies then i want on the oil industry which we have to hold on to think that was actually another one of the lies which you know you get to in just a second i know we'll get to that but i don't understand when these oil companies are making billions and billions and billions of dollars they continue to get tagged they get to do think about the most of my marital advice and i don't think they're going to i have no problem with eliminating subsidies or not everybody does wonders everybody wonders why the president said you could paltry tightens up so that i we're all sort of talking about it but everybody wonders why the president's paltry tax cuts didn't work and the reason why they didn't work is because we have a massive regulatory state that has grown under the president in cost we have to

cut those costs right now small businesses businesses with twenty employees or less are playing eleven thousand dollars per employee per year and i know it's a democracy i beg to differ i think what we saw from the stimulus package would be the biggest middle class tax cut in american history but we saw you going to the president at home just like i want to so i can the president created four point three million jobs on top of the form and a million jobs present when the president put his hand on the bible and on top of the twenty first of two thousand and nine we were at eight negative eight percent g.d.p. growth now every quarter since we've seen. we've seen the g.d.p. growth of the positives that are telling you those are all the result is that even with my seven hundred a seven hundred billion dollars stimulus package get out of nowhere this was that it did absolutely not got us out of it was our national interests were still in recession it got us out of depression we had all the orders actually we're not in a recession when the back to energy here's here is mitt romney on energy. you put ninety billion dollars into it to green jobs and i look i'm all in favor of green energy ninety billion that would have that would have hired two million teachers

ninety billion dollars and these businesses many of them are going out of business i think about half of them of the ones have been invested in it go to business. fact twenty three billion of the ninety billion went toward clean coal energy efficiency upgrades updating the electric grid environmental cleanup and largely for old nuclear weapons sites as of late last year only three out of the twenty six recipients of seventeen hundred five loan guarantees to file for bankruptcy with as to with losses estimated at six tenth's of one billion dollars six hundred billion dollars so and beyond that andrew what's wrong with investing in clean energy well first of all i don't really do not like i don't believe the government should be picking winners and losers in that way i don't know i don't i don't think that they should be doing that but then we're all going to be losers what we're all going to die if i did mitt romney i would have focused on celebrity last night i would focus on the fact you have the president clinton cylinder he mentioned it but he didn't

focus on it i would have focused on cylinder i would have talked about the fact it was the president's cronies who got government listen tom you and i have talked about government corruption the past government corruption comes in corruption comes in when the government can transfer and when you massive amounts of government money to private individuals to further their big study abroad well that's the basis of coronado alexander five hundred five hundred million dollars it went back to how i've hundred million dollars going to the president's cordy's which which frenzy on that and all the other departments said most of the energy department said this will do. this will fail on x. date and it failed on x. date and yet there seems to be no discussion whatsoever of answer a couple points here first point is when we were they were giving out no bid contracts at all which is the oil but if there was no tea party out here protesting doesn't point one zero point two when president obama took office hold on a second when president obama took office we only had one percent of the green battery technology degree battery industry now the united states competing against china japan and germany with twenty percent of them are world market share battery technology because the president made investment in the greatest with this country

has the american and how where and how are electric cars working out for us i'm talking about the green battery in this you know how can that we have all of the bodies we have actually they're working out so well that the japanese are making a lot of money selling them here well our auto industry says. certainly isn't doing it here is a ship several a is doing well that will also be well to disaster rice nobody is buying them to look at the fisker automotive as one hundred thousand dollar car that uses an electric bass and leaf is one hundred percent electric it's doing great they're not doing well because people can't afford them there are over price and that's one of the problems with these electric cars i mean your battery ever has to be problem all these are cars are under thirty thousand dollars these are they're expensive if i can afford one maybe you can with all the money you've been here and so i can order for a new car i would never go out and buy a green car because they are really expensive and they're also so they wouldn't be reasonable for us to say you know gee this technology is expensive this this this and yet this technology is what's going to save the planet from melting down with global warming so maybe we should be subsidizing it so our grandchildren our

children grandchildren great grandchildren don't end up in a world is dying around them we shouldn't do that because if it's going to make money if it is such a great make knology let the free market work let people are not best as money and there is no such thing as a free r. and so on keeping in mind that what again cost of regulation the fact that energy costs have gone up to make electric cars far far more expensive to own and operate and run and then you think about of course because we're getting it if we're driving up the price of electricity it makes it much much more expensive for people to have their electric cars and to fuel them and the and they're going to happen in germany when they go when they go when the government stepped in the government came in and said ok we will give anybody who owns a home we will back through the banks write the not a government dollar was spent on this the banks will loan you a ten year ten year mortgage to put solar panels on the roof your house and then they said the electric companies who want to build two new nuclear power plants they said to go out to power they said electric companies you buy that electricity

at seven times the current rate for ten year period which is the period of time i would take to pay for the nuclear power plant that's the exact same amount of money as a two nukes would cost and we'll see. we can build two gigawatts with the solar power they built out ten gigawatts of solar power they had to stop the program at the end of a years because there are so many solar they have a grand canyon now and i'll point out that there are that you know you want to talk about car companies the fact that two major german automatic factors are now building cars here in america because the cost of doing business over there has got to do with what we're talking about and you don't are you going to be able to live there because the government throws up if if if you are if you are taxing they're making carson because they're selling cars here well i'm also because it's cheaper to buy like you know we'd be more like our socialist friends in france and have more nuclear power plants would be a good idea do you hear the report today the i.a.e.a. a e a there's not a single french nuclear power plant that meets the basic safety standards so france is scrambling twenty three billion dollars of they're going to spend to upgrade

their nuclear power plants i'm sure the truth of the matter is that the only way this country is going to work in oregon to get this economy back on track is we have to invest in america's greatest resource is what he called the but you know we get all this out of the money that just wanted the money we use the money we printed for the war in afghanistan in iraq we can use that money to start with a member can do whatever you need to do the money or it has been printed you were going to get in drug bill the door path and then you could have been on a plane i could draw you i don't want to do this president on his tax cut who's going to write all those monies into or did every year every year he's run a trillion just as good really simple question there's a difference between spending and investment what would you invest in if you were running the government right now i would well if i were running the government the got there just wasn't it's not what i'm doing us out the government be investing what you would not is outing richard what would you invest were taishan reform high speed rail lines ok defense defense if you think that's an investment of well it's a constitutional function of the federal government i don't feel it is it is actually in the constitution three that it is an investment because if you are defending your country you can continue to do business and just

a bunch of props i would want to invest in education i think we should be investing is not our job the role ha how is it not what states should do states should do health care state constitution clearly gives congress the. the next and i don't know it's just the right but the obligation of the first to make convention doesn't give give the government any rights let's make that very clear the constitution of the right solution so to impose it is not good no and those are my words those are not rights any time we're going to progress you're actually you're actually right yeah i can see that but in fact we'll wrap it up a little bit about it we'll up right with a last word lest i end of this to andrew richard brian thank you very much i think the facts will be that. crazy alert brazilians like big butts and the law of the nation of brazil is

getting ready to celebrate big bodacious boots enormous bum bum pageant is about to get underway that has been is a nationwide contest that seeks to find the best natural barrier in the country twenty seven contestants were chosen in the first round of the pageant one from each of brazil's federative unions from the twenty seven on line voting will determine the final fifteen who get to sell paulo brazil for the best but finals in november captures the imagination in the attention of the eyes in the eyes of the entire nation annually it is not without controversy one contestants have velva barrow was almost disqualified from the voting rounds because judges thought she might have thought implants but after an x. ray proved that her cheeks weren't tainted tainted the judges let her back into the competition so if you like a whole lot of buoy shake and fun then up on a plane and head down to brazil which on. coming up the phone lines are now open for the debut of our new york take my take it live segment so if you want

the chance to ask me a question live or talk on the big picture give us a call at two zero two nine zero four twenty one thirty four give us a call now maybe i'll be talking with you right after the break. if.

you know how sometimes you see a story and it seems so you think you understand it and then something else you hear sees some other part of it and realize everything you thought you knew you don't know i'm sorry welcome to the big picture.